2-stroke or 4-stroke?

[jct842]

A new 250-300cc 2 stroke would be awesome

[50cc]

Originally Posted by jct842

A new 250-300cc 2 stroke would be awesome

Yeah, with the mileage of a small car lol

[ryan52]

2 strokes can last just as long as any 4 stroke. as for gas mileage you can easily have 75 plus with a 2t for mpg. i believe 2t's are safer also ther faster and can keep up with traffic better

[jct842]

It sure ain't going to deter me even if there were a big difference in mileage with a 2 stroke. Even with todays high gas costs,.......... to me the performance difference is what I would like. When I drove a pickup you got 16mpg maybe. I get 55/60 with the big one and 70/75 with the little one and filling either up isn't that big a deal, I prefer riding the little chinese 150 if its a short trip, and not for the gas but for the better roundtown handling.

[prodigit]

I also prefer a 150 (or tuned BBK 50cc) for round town riding.
I feel like my ATM50 is ALMOST enough for city riding, with one exception, is the acceleration between 20-35MPH.
Something a BBK could solve.

As far as MPG numbers on a 2stroke, it's kind of moot. A 2 stroke's fuel is a lot more expensive, due to the oil added to the fuel, thus can not compare to a 4 stroke.
If anything, if a 50cc 4 stroke gets 100MPG, a 2 stroke needs to get 125MPG to get even in fuel economy. A 150cc gets more than the power of a 2 stroke 50cc, while getting between 65-75MPG (85-95MPG for fuel injected). A 2 stroke 50cc would need to get at least 90-100MPG to beat the 150cc; $$ for $$ in fuel economy.

as far as reliability, it all depends on what brand, where made etc.
But under exactly the same conditions, a 2 stroker lasts less long than a 4 stroker.
Way more heat, runs way less efficient, and has way more wear.

[inuyasha]

Originally Posted by prodigit

I also prefer a 150 (or tuned BBK 50cc) for round town riding.
I feel like my ATM50 is ALMOST enough for city riding, with one exception, is the acceleration between 20-35MPH.
Something a BBK could solve.

As far as MPG numbers on a 2stroke, it's kind of moot. A 2 stroke's fuel is a lot more expensive, due to the oil added to the fuel, thus can not compare to a 4 stroke.
If anything, if a 50cc 4 stroke gets 100MPG, a 2 stroke needs to get 125MPG to get even in fuel economy. A 150cc gets more than the power of a 2 stroke 50cc, while getting between 65-75MPG (85-95MPG for fuel injected). A 2 stroke 50cc would need to get at least 90-100MPG to beat the 150cc; $$ for $$ in fuel economy.

as far as reliability, it all depends on what brand, where made etc.
But under exactly the same conditions, a 2 stroker lasts less long than a 4 stroker.
Way more heat, runs way less efficient, and has way more wear.

Hi
Are these numbers your posting based on first hand knowledge or just a guess on your part
I own both 2 t 50s and 4 t 50s and their mileage is very close in fact my 95 cc bbk redstreak gets poorer mileage then my 2 t aprilia
And as to the oil a 2 t uses less or the same amount of oil that a 4 t would use between oil changes
I use a quart of oil or less every 500 or so miles for both 2 t and 4 t
And if well mantained and taken care of a 2 t can last just as long if not longer
I hardly even have to push "april" to wot but with the 4t i do so more wear on the 4t as opposed to the 2t
Take care and ride safely dear friend
Yours Hank

[scootnwinn]

Hank if you keep that up I will have to get a 2t. Do you think your April will do my 20 mile commute at speeds near 60 for half of it?

[MEAN_MOTOFINO]

4t will last longer without a doubt. No need to go into details. Also I like the more mature, grown up exhaust note of a 4t(deep).

[inuyasha]

Originally Posted by scootnwinn

Hank if you keep that up I will have to get a 2t. Do you think your April will do my 20 mile commute at speeds near 60 for half of it?

Hi
She could do it all day with the LC she never gets hot
Take care and ride safely dear friend
Yours Hank

[inuyasha]

Originally Posted by MEAN_MACHINE_MOTOFINO

4t will last longer without a doubt. No need to go into details. Also I like the more mature, grown up exhaust note of a 4t(deep).

Hi
I ask you as well is that statement based on first hand experiance or simply conjecture
Ive seen 2ts hit 10,000 miles easily
My "April" has close to 5,000 trouble free mile under her belt and i expect another 5,000 easily
Take care and ride safely drear friend
Yours Hank

[scootnwinn]

Hank the bummer part is the only Aprilia dealer is about 400 miles away...

I think when people think 2 stroke the only reference some have are highly tuned motocross bikes. I can say for certain Hank, based on 3 years in a motorcycle shop, that in the dirtbikes at least, 4 strokes last much longer, kind of. Let me explain. Basically a top end (new piston and a boring) are considered normal maintenance. we all know that refreshing a top end on a 2-stroke is a simple job however. Overall though with care and attention to detail a 2 stroke can be reliable. I'm sure a stock scooter isn't tuned like a dirtbike nor is it generally driven in a similar manner in the same harsh conditions so though a top-end may be needed someday it could be a long way off. Additionally adding water cooling makes a huge difference in longevity... So there you go conjecture-less opinion

[Irish]

Having been a mechanic since the age of 15 (automotive & motorcycle,marine,aircraft, etc mechanic) & having gone to a factory motorcycle school , I much prefer four strokes. I used to spend a lot of time drag racing motorcycles & a 4 stroke gets its power from torque & a 2 stroke relies on RPM , so I guess it all depends on your uses. Irish
P.S. I just turned 71 so that's a lot of yrs. spent wrenching!

[Firehawk989]

I will just echo what Hank said and say that my 2T Yamaha BWS had 16,500km on it when I replaced the stock cylinder with the 70cc one. Not because the stock cylinder failed or anything like that, but because I wanted the extra power. Now I've put 5,600km on my 70cc kit so far and am sitting at 22,100km. My scoot is my daily driver for my commute to and from work and has been rock solid reliable.

Also as for the exhaust note, my pipe got very loud over the last few months and started to sound high-pitched and annoying like a chain saw. This bothered me quite a bit, so I took apart the silencer and re-packed it with some new high quality glass matting designed for 2-stroke silencers. Now it sounds much deeper and quieter! The note is similar to an Infiniti G35/Nissan 350Z if you've ever heard one of those drive by.

[zumaguy123]

Hi,

My only scooter exp comes from having owned 2 4-stroke Zumas ( I owned a Puch and 2 Tomos mopeds in my teens but don't count them because they were used as toys not actual transportation).

Anyways, I've seen guys post about hitting 10,000+ miles on 2t scooters (and similar stuff elsewhere in 2t vs 4t debates) as if that's a lot of mileage and a big accomplishment--is that much mileage on a 2-t considered a big deal or something?

Shoot I'm pushing 13,000 miles on a 2014 Zuma with no real issues and I know of guys on 4-stroke Hondas, Yamaha C-3s, and Genuine's hitting 25-35 thousand miles without engine failure or a rebuild needed.

Based on what I've seen, I would think its obvious that a 4-stroke is superior when it comes to longevity. No?

[kz1000st]

There are so many factors to consider in two stroke longevity. How it's used, the oil used and how it's cooled. Most people don't keep two wheeled machines for more than a few years and don't generally put a lot of miles on them during that time. By the time the machine gets to its third of fourth owner it's been through hell. My experience is that two strokes mainly wear their rings and barrels faster because they're lubed by gas thinned oil. The lower ends are usually fine since many auto lube systems pump through the main bearings first. Everything after that usually suffers lube issues in the long term.